January 9, 2009
- Body as Akashic Karmic recorder. -
Memories/Impressions are collected to create the informational body, and the effects of this are reflected in the physical body. The flaws in the informational bodies also manifest in the physical body. They can be worked out only through a holistic confrontation of the problem from all aspects of the being.
“Pull up the intruder by the root of the weed…”
The poison is not removed until you can face it and it has no effect. The key is to be honest enough to make sure that you just haven’t buried it too deeply (look up Scientology’s practice of removing engrams) Buried things always come back up, no matter what. The more that’s built on top of them, the more that will have to be destroyed to remove them.
(note that The Tower’s old name was “La Maison Dieu)
You can’t build a house for god, not without admitting to yourself that you are squaring the circle. The Heaven->Earth circuit is an ever changing thing. Houses without fluid foundations are not welcome. But houses are needed none the less…
Profound.
Comment by C8lin — January 12, 2009 @ 4:13 am
I’ve been getting younger looking for the last four years or so. I’m not saying I’m Benjamin Button or anything and I don’t think I will go on like this forever.
But I think I am releasing trauma from my body.
Comment by Ted — January 12, 2009 @ 12:14 pm
@ C8lin: Thanks! I actually had to take my own advice over the meditation intensive this weekend, as far as the Aes Rock quote is concerned. Had not realized how much my practice has been slipping…
@ Ted: Definitely, me too actually. Although quitting smoking probably helped, in my case. It’s the fine tuning of a vastly complex machine, which we REALLY have to remember is already made to function pretty damn well. Adjustments must be made with extreme care. But on the other hand “releasing trauma” is probably never a bad thing.
Gurdjieff had a lot of interesting theories about how much potential we as humans were failing to live up to. Hopefully I’ll be able to work him in more here, although I don’t think I’m ready for that yet!
Comment by Ian — January 12, 2009 @ 12:53 pm
There is some guy that runs Kepher.org or some site that sounds similar to that, and I really respect him. He rates different Gurus. He talks about Ken Wilbur and DA Free John, and other people.
He said Gurdjieff wasn’t enlightened. I also saw a movie clip of Gurdjieff and he was really really corpulent. I mean like nearly 400 lbs. It bugged me a lot.
So I guess I kind of take Gurdjieff with a grain of salt now. I tried to read that horrible book he wrote about Lucifer’s Nephew and I ripped it to shreds, I got so angry and had such a migraine headache. My impression is its a big insult. Its like a sadistic joke. Its basically him flipping you the bird page after page for like a thousand pages. What kind of a person can sustain that kind of malevolence for that length of time in order to write such a book?
It really is malevolence. It gives you a headache to read, a really bad headache. Its the most tortured arcane prose you could possibly imagine. The joke is you wade through it and endure a headache because you think there are jewels of wisdom hidden in there. But the joke is that there isn’t. Its all rubbish. Its a burlesque. Total drivel. The joke ends up being on you.
I think people like us should give ourselves a little more credit. We have the ability to discern and synthesize more than we think. There isn’t much Gurdjieff had access to that we don’t. I did like a lot of books his students wrote based on his lectures and teachings. I do think he had gifts but I no longer see him as a towering figure.
Comment by Ted — January 13, 2009 @ 11:02 am
The book may have had the intended effect on me, after all, but it still annoys me.
Comment by Ted — January 13, 2009 @ 11:12 am
“The book may have had the intended effect on me, after all, but it still annoys me.”
Glad you added that, as that was indeed Gurdjieff’s stated premise for writing the book in such a twisted language. Beelzebub’s Tales is the only book I’ve read on Gurdjieff’s theories, as I find Ouspensky WAY to intellectual for my taste (although I have read a few other memoirs of G’s students as well). O gives me a headache, more than G does…
Personally though, I am loving Beelzebub’s Tales, and am about halfway through it. I do indeed find it quite difficult, but I enjoy the precision on his language and thought. I have found many jewels in there, as far as new ways of looking at the world.
I don’t know if Gurdjieff could be considered “enlightened”. But his “reality tunnel” is interesting as hell to me. His theories create so much potential for humanity, and they point out the many, many ways which we are not living up to our potential. It points towards something quite hopeful, if you can stand to get through the depressing bits. In fact, I think his biggest problem may have been that he spent too much time breaking down, and not enough building up.
Then again, maybe I’m just wiseacring here…
Either way, I’m still only reading Beelzebub’s Tales. I haven’t gotten to the other books yet… We will see.
(and no, I’m not planning on reading them all 3 times…)
Comment by Ian — January 13, 2009 @ 11:38 am
Here is what I think it is. Gurdjieff talked about stuff we know to be true. We know these things to be true, because we have a certain level of spiritual development. Other people don’t talk about these things.
I mean its just silly how mainstream culture denies spiritual things, everyday psi phenomena etc.
So the tendency is to give way too much credit to people that acknowledge these things.
But then on the other hand you have people like Rupert Sheldrake that attempts to be really rigorous and dialogue with actual scientists and because of that he has to stick with what is really basic.
So if you want to advance, you need a system. Its nice to be able to just kind of take off on something.
But nobody is perfect, no system is perfect. But if you have a system and a jargon and a bunch of people, tradition etc. you can navigate this stuff. You can also get really far out on a limb. So you need “reality checks.” But Consensual reality that provides the checks is just soooo backward, its a serious problem.
But anyway, I can’t give much credit to a grossly overweight chainsmoker on achieving supernatural type longevity. Even Fred Alan Wolf, a much more down to Earth Guy, a stand up guy, it would seem. He looks happy and healthy but still old. Just as old as any baby boomer. RAW died just like everyone else. These are people we look up to to give us insights and they are all failures.
Then there are other spiritual traditions of people embracing death, being mindful of death, accepting the cycle.
So I’m not sure what to think. Maybe the best I can do is not age prematurely.
Comment by Ted — January 13, 2009 @ 11:40 am
Yeah, who knows for sure?
I will say though, that I don’t think anyone can give someone an insight. I really like Eckart Tolle’s description of the process, in which he likens it to trying to catch a pile of wood on fire. Wood dries out and burns faster if it is put next to other wood that is already burning. But it’s up to each of us to catch fire, no one else will do it for us.
I think we can have other people’s paths communicated to us, but walking in their steps won’t replicate their experience, because we’re not them. The Tao that can be told of is not the true Tao, and all that…
Comment by Ian — January 13, 2009 @ 11:51 am
I actually liked Ouspensky better.
The best thing I got out of this is about building up this “juice” or whatever, I forget what they call it. Maybe its what others call “prana” but anyway, you really do need a strong healthy body to have it.
A lot of it is sexual energy though. Indians and Asians think you can squander it. So they believe in celibacy. Not ejaculating much even if you are married. They reason that just like you have only so many heartbeats and breaths in a life span you only have so many ejaculations. So the idea is to conserve them and prolong life. If you could take one breath a day you could live thousands of years.
But anyway this sexual energy makes you more psychic. Gurdjieff had a lot of this, I think, so he was in turn very charismatic. But he was a hedonist also because of this tendency.
There is a connection to this and creativity, with artists and writers. Two schools of thought. Some are like boxers and think “women weaken legs” and others have a big creative output and a big sexual output at the same time. Some sublimate, some don’t.
But anyway, when I was 20, 21, I had massive amounts of this energy, like most guys that age. But I was also more conscious than a lot of people. I think what it was is that I thought like a little kid still and took psi stuff for granted. I thought more like an animist. The reason I didn’t have this indoctrinated out of me is because at a young age I started to catch on that I was smarter than a lot of adults I knew. So I didn’t take peoples word for stuff.
But I was still young and lacked self discipline. But anyway, I can sense I had more potential back then for remote viewing and OBE’s and stuff. But 21 is a tough age. I think some stuff in your brain in the prefrontal cortex is still developing and there is the potential to go a little whacky. I almost did. I ended up becoming a fundamentalist Christian order to ride out the storm. Because it was too much for me, all this psychic new age stuff. It all came so easy to me it was scary and overwhelming, so I tuned it all out and even stopped drawing. Because drawing for me was psychic. I employed psychic abilities through it.
So I am thinking a 20 year old with lots of chi and a good brain and potential for psychic abilities if he was in a school and had a good teacher and had the ability to listen and be disciplined. The potential would be enormous.
Comment by Ted — January 13, 2009 @ 12:05 pm
I doubt that Gurdjieff was a hedonist, from everything I’ve heard about him, life at his school was not easy, nor did he ever seem to have enough money to live in anything like luxury.
His “juice” supposedly came from lots of practice with hypnotism. But as far as what builds up the “juice” and what wastes it, I think that’s dependent on everything from genetics to culture to personal beliefs. Mainly though, I think it’s based on one’s intent.
In the end though, where does it get us, being able to do any of that stuff? I don’t really care too much about pursuing it myself. Why bother? Maybe it’s just sour grapes on my part, but the more times I ask myself why, the less I can come to a satisfactory answer…
Technology already does so many “magic” things for us, why bother using our minds/spirits to those ends? I can do remote viewing too. It’s called a webcam. ;)
Comment by Ian — January 13, 2009 @ 12:46 pm
Because, here is why:
You need energy in order to project. Did you watch that clip by Rupert Sheldrake? Vision not only involves creating an image in our brain, it also involves projecting that image back out into space. The more “juice” you have the farther you can project.
You need to literally build a bridge to heaven.
Comment by Ted — January 14, 2009 @ 11:07 am
He was a hedonist himself. He didn’t teach hedonism. Picture a really fat parent that chainsmokes, coaching his child to be an olympic gymnast. Thats my impression of him.
And say the kid actually made it to the olympics.
So I don’t think I am judging him too harshly, in my analogy. But anyway, I think its possible that too much discipline can kill something in a person that can be a source of power. I think he may have had that dynamic. Maybe discipline is better for some people than others.
There are different types of people, with different needs. Gurdjieff strikes me as a type that I don’t usually get along with. Because he asks you to trust him and submit to him. That appears to have been his manner. But who did he ever submit to? What school is he a product of? He’s a maverick. He never submitted to anybody.
To me, reading that book and having to read “three brained beings” and all those other long redundant phrases, over and over again, is an act of submission. I am sure that is the intent. Its like having to bow to him over and over again. The headache you get from the tortured prose, is “intentional suffering” he is putting you through and that you are continually submitting to by continuing to read on.
So anyway, I’m too much like him to submit to it. I am like him in that, he would never put up with that from anyone elese either, and unlike him, in that I don’t get anything out of putting others through that. I’m not a sadist.
Comment by Ted — January 14, 2009 @ 11:20 am
I think with the “juice” also, its kind of like advanced yogi’s that can do all this stuff, like walk on water when they reach a certain level, but if they are going to continue on the path, they decide not to do it because doing it can stop their growth. They need all that juice for other stuff they have to do. Impressing people with cool feats is a distraction.
So building up this force, is still good, even if doing the tricks is not. Because there are other uses you must put it too.
The thing with the webcam-I think its like this, if you just passively rely on it, thats bad. If you get inside it, interact with it, figure out how it works and use it as a feedback system for psychic abilities, its good.
That’s my impression of what Tim is after. He is creating refernce points and feedback systems with technology.
Transcending time and space is not new. Its not something that has never been done before and now we are all waiting with bated breath as technology finally does it. No.
Its been done before. Its the goal of humanity to do that. The technology is approaching it from a different direction is all. But there isn’t anything being done that thse yogis haven’t already done.
So there is maybe a way to take a shortcut. But not if you just rely on it passively.
Comment by Ted — January 14, 2009 @ 11:36 am
“Building a bridge to heaven”
Exactly. I just meant, why use that “juice” for powers like remote viewing and what-not? I completely agree with the idea that people who develop enough “juice” have more important things to use it on then displays of super-powers…
I would say, though, that the difference of technology achieving these things, and the reason it excites me (and worries me at the same time) more so than yoga, Taoism, etc, is that technology is universally useful. Everyone can use it, without putting in the work. But in the end, I put my faith in the WHATEVER-IT-IS that all this is for the best.
As for Gurdjieff, I think it’s best we just agree that we have different viewpoints on him. I don’t disagree with what you’re saying, but for me, his work still proves to be useful regardless of that. We’ve all got different paths, but they lead to the same thing in the end.
Comment by Ian — January 14, 2009 @ 2:31 pm
Also, in regards to technological superpowers, check out JOhn Robb (who, granted, I know you are not exactly a fan of, Ted), on “individual superempowerment”:
http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/globalguerrillas/2009/01/journal-interdicting-diy-weapons.html
This is what I mean. People have become so much capable of accomplishing things because of all this new technology, immensely so in a very short period of time. Will we collectively develop a technology that allows us to break through to the other side, where powers and siddhis are no longer necessary, or will we simply crash and burn? I am sincerely hoping we can make that make that breakthrough happen. Otherwise, we’re in for a LONG dark night…
Comment by Ian — January 14, 2009 @ 2:58 pm
I’m probably too hard on people. I’m still interested in learning from Gurdjieff, don’t get me wrong.
Anyway, I have been catching up on all your posts and you have a lot of cool ideas here. Btw, are you from Monterey? I love Monterey! I was stationed in the Army there for three years. I loved it! Always between 70 or 80 degrees, misty once in a while, nice Ocean breezes, awesome. I used to take long walks there too. Like 15 20 miles at a time all through Carmel and Montery.
Comment by Ted — January 15, 2009 @ 1:48 pm
In regards to Gurdjieef, Cadeveo summed up my thoughts on him in his recent non-post over at Waking The Midnight Sun… Dirty paths are still paths! :)
And yeah, I grew up around Monterey/Salinas/Carmel. I assume you were stationed at Fort Ord, yeah? What years?
Comment by Ian — January 15, 2009 @ 2:55 pm
Meant to include a link to Cadeveo’s post…
These new buttons are great. Thanks again to Tim!
Comment by Ian — January 15, 2009 @ 2:56 pm
89 to 92
Comment by Ted — January 16, 2009 @ 2:07 pm
Damn, you were stationed there in the army when I was still in grade school. Crazy!
It’s kind of a cliche at this point, but it’s still weird to see how the paths we all take through life might cross and recross without our even knowing.
Comment by Ian — January 16, 2009 @ 2:37 pm
Yeah, I’m an old fart. I feel young though.
I saw Clint Eastwood once there. I used to go to his bar the Hog’s breath.Plus I saw John Madden a couple times on the street. I liked that place a lot. I guess I liked Carmel the most.
Comment by Ted — January 17, 2009 @ 12:08 pm